Mywhoosh has running too. Same price as cycling 
Yes, I am just looking for more excuses. I am getting closer to pulling the trigger.
1 Like
Trigger pulled. Sportano had 30% off the exact model I wanted so I could not pass it up. Matrix TF50 and I can claim as business expense and add running to TD so another 23% off and income tax reduction. My wife is still going to kill me. 
It comes with FTMS so we will have to add running to TD.
@dthrog00 So Jonathan @Ivegotabike and Tomas @BlackTek and I are all running. We are the 4 amigos that chime in on most training. Maybe you want to join us? I went on a ride today and I swear my running is making cycling easier to push harderā¦ I am starting to feel that āathleteā motivation feeling which is so great. I was getting nervous it might not come back but I see with some consistency here it is. I also have a new theory that when you are short on time, adding a bit of running might do more for performance per minute that cycling. This is very early theory not well researched but this is how it feels. Duration is usually the winner but if you are doing 5-6 hours a week 2 hours of running and 3-4 hours of cycling might be the better payoff. Usually specificity wins so I hesitant to say this is trueā¦ but something feels different.
3 Likes
It is worth repeating over and over again that if you are new to running, start gently and progress slowly.
But I agree with @Alex it is well worth considering.
Even the 2x ~30 minute easy runs per week that I am doing are, imo, worth it.
1 Like
I tried running before. I looked back at October-December 2023 I had 7 runs as part of a walk-to-run 5K program. I recall quitting due to it beating me up physically, thinking it was getting in the way of cycling, and generally questioning if it was fun.
Maybe I would consider trying it again, but Iād hazard a guess Iām probably painfully slow compared to you guys. Looks like I made it as far as 1:30 runs/2:00 walk cycles with 12 minute miles for the ārunningā and 20 minute miles for the walking.
2026 has been a strange year. I was doing really well with my cycling until about the end of May. I had a bad cold in June, we ended up working on some house projects in July/start of August, then I cut my thumb about 2 weeks ago and needed 3 sutures. Normally consistency has been my strong point, but it has been really bad this summer. I have some time off now and weāre getting hit with a late summer heat wave and high winds. Canāt win I guess. I think Iāve become a fair weather cyclist.
Dave
1 Like
Fair weather is me most of the time. In my 20s -30c snowshoe camping was fine. At peak motivation levels yesterday, I was proud to do 90 minutes in warm, windy, mostly light rain. Weather report was 85.% chance and I went anyway. Sand, gravel, grass and rain. But this level of motivation in recent years is rare.
Regarding running I was like you (I sucked, it was painful and seemed my body was not built for it) but then some reading inspired me to think differently. Truly embracing run/walk and going seriously slow 12m/m is much faster than I started. The other day I was working hard to stay under 120bpm and that was 11 m/km almost 40% slower than you. Very easy to pass me walking. My fun is being ultra careful, giving my body time to build it takes months or years of consistency for tendons and ligaments.
So I shuffle ārunā as long as possible until I hit 120bpm and then walk. Now I can ārunāabout 4k before needing a short walk. Switch to metric system for running. Your previous 7:30 m/km sounds ok my marathon pace 12 years ago was 7:00 m/km so even in shape I was slow.
I remember at times it felt mentally easier to run in bad weather than bike. Biking is more fun in nice weather for me for sure and my real goal but running might help with that goal. Also running strengthens your bones if you approach it carefully / smart.
2 Likes
It is the musculoskeletal benefits that I am most interested in.
Cycling is such a low impact activity, that supplementing it with something that has some higher impacts has to be good for bones, joints, tendons etc.
However, as those things respond and adapt more slowly than the aerobic and muscular side of the equation (especially as we age), starting gently and progressing consistently, but slowly is (imo) essential.
1 Like
Exactly. I also did deep research to see if I could find anything that would point to my thinking regarding running improving cycling more than cycling itself in some cases. I would say there is nothing that would confirm this theoryā¦ So fairly unlikely itās true.
A couple other things I learned. So cycling is a concentric activity pushing and pedals moving forward. Eccentric training is popular in rehabilitation. Andrea has a motorized eccentric bike in his lab. His FTP is usually around 230w but he said he could do 400w for an hour after about a month of training. You push forward like in cycling the motor is making pedals go backwards. So you are holding the pedals from going as fast as they want. He said he also got up to 90 rpm of pedals going backwardsā¦ This seems crazy. Anyway a pro came in one day and started doing it. Andrea suggested to the pro to stop after 10 minutes. The pro said it is so easy he will do it for 30 minutes. He could barely walk for 3 daysā¦. Eccentric cycling requires expensive equipment, so it might be beneficial no one seems to do it. So not enough benefit for the trouble it would seem.
Anyway my point is running is heavily eccentric (slowing your falling body weight), which means you are producing more energy for the same amount of aerobic input (HR) in running vs cycling. People decent at running and cycling all have much higher FTP in running than cycling. FTP is power and power = energy spent. Also partially shown by more calories per hour running for similar RPEā¦. So this additional energy might have some cycling benefits but again no proof of this.
1 Like
I donāt think running brings much improvements, if any, to cycling. It helps keeping the aerobic engine on when youāve off-bike periods (like me during holidays) and to stay motivated/consistent. Moreover it helps bones because all that eccentric work creates micro fractures that on the long term improve calcium usage and bones consistency.
Iāve restarted running after 5-6 years (I started cycling exactly 4 years ago). I started this July super slowly and only breathing with nose (to put a cap and avoid to go too fast as my aerobic engine is much more powerful than my tendons). First day 3km, day after rest, day after 5km, day after rest, day after 8 km, day after rest, day after 10km. Pace going from 8m/km to 6:30/km.
Now, after two months, Iām running at around 5:30m/km with a good hr% (low aerobic), and every once in a while doing some 100/200mt strides at 3:30/km.
Iām progressing very slowly (like I want), but very hard for me to find the time for running which doesnāt impact cycling (I do weights 2 times per week and cycling 4 times per week). At the moment Iām running 12km on the only free day that I had (Wednesday 
) + 35/40 min after a z2 long (4-5h) cycling session, normally on Sunday.
Of course my wife is saying that Iām crazy (and probably she is right) with 8 training sessions per week (taking almost 20h per week) 
But yes @Ivegotabike , first rule is to start gently and do not push too much to not receive a too big bill the day(s) after. At least for the first 3-4 months. I perhaps started a bit too aggressive with running (compared to a regular Joe), but it also depends on your fitness level and the level of fatigue you can manage and your recovery speed.
Good luck with running to you all
1 Like
I agree running offer a lot of benefits.
Iāve heard of people cross training with rowing effectively also.
I think lifting weights (or some version of resistance training) is probably the most valuable side hobby to cycling.
Dave
1 Like
No improvements to cycling, I assume you mean if running is taking away from your cycling time or your limiter is recovery. But for a minimalist if itās additive, it likely does help. I know a friend that his friend is a runner and he is cyclist and his runner friend does not bike much but stronger than him on the bike even though he is a cyclists (at the lower end of cycling performance). But yes, I doubt for most cyclists running is adding much performance. It might be for me since it is more additive then replacing.
1 Like
Yes, I have a rowing machine, my wife uses it. I think it is amazing but I am too lazyā¦ partially because it is outdoors and coveredā¦ But I really want to start. I feel if I can get to the next level of motivation where more training does not bury me I will.
AIUI, for absolute cycling performance at the top level, running is probably not a good use of the training time.
For those using cycling for healthspan type reasons, running as part of an overall exercise plan has more value.
2 Likes
running creates doms lasting more than cycling and hurting cycling performance. I can run only after a z2 ride or the day before a z2 ride. If I run the day before of a quality ride I ruin it 
Whereas because my runs (jogs really) are so easy and so short, I do them on what are currently my hard cycling workout days. Bike in the morning, run in the early evening.
When does the treadmill arrive?
It got to the local warehouse yesterday but still not out for delivery. Today is estimated delivery date.
EDIT: It arrived as soon as I sent this message.
I used AI to convince me it was important to buy it Claude thinks I deserve it and business purpose is more than enough justificationā¦.
Yesterday I added treadmill running to our desktop app that I will be testing. The good part is I already see clearly that I can build a better running product by being deeper into it right now. One thing I see is that running POWER is a total mess. There is no standard methodology for calculating power (virtual power) so Garmin is like 50% higher than stryd for example. One of my partners has a stryd and runs a lot and stryd can not accurately estimate treadmill inclineā¦ Messā¦
Also looking at science studies neither stryd nor Garmin are very well aligned with previous science forumals. Total mess. This took me down what I consider a much better path. Intervals supports GAP (grade adjusted pace) so does Strava and they are formula aligned. This is the better approach that power. It kind of means the same thing but more simplified and more standardized. GAP focuses on what runners wanting to train should focus on. Sure getting technique right is important but that is independent of training pace from my perspective.
1 Like
You can execute running workouts in Zwift if you want to do walk/run, etcā¦ , but on my treadmill you have to change the belt speed manually. Zwift in that instance is more like a time keeper than anything else.
Dave
Yes, mine has FTMS so it can record and show speed in zwift, but I will use TD desktop most likelyā¦ But I will try zwift for sureā¦ but I do have to adjust speed and incline manually. I think Wahoo does automatic but I donāt trust their longevity at this point. Their tread is too new.