I have noticed that the app during change one phase of structured workout to the next. When the new power value is presented the device is reacting to a change after 5-8 seconds. This never happened to me on TR, so it looks like you need to fix it.!
The other problem is shown in the image below. This workout had a constant power setting, however at the end there was a sudden spike of power for an unknown reason.Zrzut ekranu 2023-02-13 o 11.36.39|230x500
What is your trainer? It’s likely a delay or an error thrown in your trainer but TR is obviously much more mature so might have special code for your trainer to increase the target time they send it. We have thousands of users and this is the first time I have heard of a delay like this, although, other users had a problem where their devices throw errors and so what we do is keep sending updates which might delay it. TR might have some magic formula to dealing with these device errors that we are not aware of how to do. If you can repeat this regularly and be willing to work with my developer then we could find the source of the problem. It’s good to know that TR did not do this.
Hi Alex, well in the early stages in TR (like 3 yrs ago) they had a similar problem. I have a KICKR v5 and KICKR BIKE - I can compare how it looks on each of them but KICKR v5 is the one I was discussing initially.
BTW. The picture attached is about a different problem I have forgotten to describe. An unexpected spike of power during a workout - you can see it when you zoom in on the spike on the picture.
The delay is likely coming from your Trainer. Meaning, from when a command is sent to your trainer to increase Power
sec 0: Power Increase command from App to Trainer (100w -> 150w)
sec 6: Trainer finally catches up and executes the command.
I would expect that diff trainers handle this differently, some react faster, some slower. In 1 part, this is due to it’s firmware to (possibly) allow for a more gradual ramp of power rather than a sudden Digital Offset which may make the pedals super hard to turn.
This “delay” doesn’t actually have much impact to an interval as you would still get the X number of seconds for that interval (eg: delay 5sec to 150w then delay 5s, at the end of the interval to 100w for instance), but it will of course it may skew your interval numbers.
(If you use intervals.icu, there’s a handy “move intervals by x seconds” option)
Strange, I don’t ride a lot, short rides a few times a week, but I also have a Kickr V5 and don’t have any issues like this.
In general the Kickr does have a 2 second delay from the time we send the target power but we automatically send it 2 seconds before the desired change so that it changes at the desired time. So specific individual trainers, not models, have errors that occur. It sounds like this is the case with yours. The spike is even more strange. Again TrainerRoad has some magic tricks that we have not figured out how to do. Unlike the Kickr, a Tacx neo is almost instant.
What phone or tablet are you using? Do you have any other devices connected?
Maybe an additional device setting with an offset. To be honest this is really long, normally 2s delay I wouldn’t bother but this is ranging from 4-6 seconds.
Like I said on my KickrV5 it is totally right on time. So at this time you are the only person I know with a problem, so I prefer not to add just a slider for you and figure out how to fix your problem. Are you saying yours is totally reliable that it happens every interval or most? If so are you willing to work with my developer?
Sorry for the slight off topic, but is the power target supposed to happen as soon as I get the audio prompt, or is the audio prompt sent a little earlier to get you ready? I do see a delay between the audio and the power target being displayed on the screen and “felt” in the legs, about 2 seconds or so, and I don’t know if it is intentional or just a little lag.
It’s 2 or 3 seconds earlier so you can prepare for the change.
Hi again. So Like I promised some time ago. I tested this software both on KICKR v5 and KICKR BIKE v1. The delay exists in both of them but worse is with KICKR v5 (latest FW). The biggest problem is at the start of the interval. The end is usually happening immediately (1-2s delay).
Why do I consider this a problem? Imagine an interval workout of N-15s attempts. The interval power is reached after 6-7 second after start of each interval. The end of the interval is quite fast, as mentioned above. In summary this will not be a good training.
Thing to observe Although start of the interval has a step change of power (not a ramp) it behaves like a ramp - I mean the trainer is simulating a ramp. Usually when a new power sets in, rider prepares for a change in intensity. Because of this delay the general feeling is mediocre.
I know this can be fixed, because this problem does not exist on TR and at this moment this is one of the least attractive things about TD. Sorry for comparison, it’s good you are doing this but there are some basic rules that need to be maintained - some who are longer in this market had done this before. You need to do some thinking here. Figure out a feedback loop of some sort or a self teaching algorithm that will minimise this issue.
I know that people here can be good at giving directions and orders but this will happen to other people, maybe not as picky as I am.
People who train indoors have a limited time and quality is more important than anything else - this does not provide quality workout. Guess I am being a little bit harsh, but I just want this software to get better.
This problem is strange as it seems unique to you. I know that is hard to believe but I have a V5 and don’t have this problem at all. Wahoo automatically does add a small ramp automatically but should not be different in our app then TR.
Some people with devices that have errors get stuff like this but since it happens to both of yours that seems unlikely. Are you using TR with bluetooth also? Same phone, same everything? Or maybe you have our power smoothing on? If so make sure and turn that off. Our power smoothing is not amazing and the Kickr has it’s own power smoothing that is much better.
It’s especially strange that it happens on both of your trainers and not on mine or any other Wahoo user that I know of. It could be some bluetooth interference but again that would be very strange it affects our app and not TR.
I can say here is group on TR reporting the same issue. They focus on interference.
Not sure that any of this helps. You could try working with my developer and he could see if he could pin point the problem. Alternatively you and I could both do the same short test workout and share files.
This would probably be good.
So here is my test from that workout. What I am seeing and feeling in the app is perfect. I feel the ramp but this is just the wahoo ramp I am used to. I have a Neo and it does not have this ramp. I prefer this slight ramp. Neo is like hitting a wall.
I am using iPhone 11 pro. Using small chainring in front and middle in the back. Not sure the sizes.
Below is from history tab in our app. In landscape, it shows the wahoo ramp also.
In our website it looks like a delay but it would change exactly on time in the app. Maybe the web history is 1 second off.
Wahoo also has power smoothing which I believe you can turn off.
I have decided to play around with Power Smoothing. Usually the trainer is smoothing the power by itself, at least there is a setting in Wahoo Companion app. So I reduced smoothing to 0 from previous 3 seconds [I am referring to smoothing in TD application’s settings - I left Wahoo smoothing intact]. This affected my workouts quite a lot - at least now the HIIT interval were working fine and I could feel the power kicking in around 3rd second of the interval. Dropping power level seems to work faster by 1 second in my perceived feeling.
To summarise, try seeing how power smoothing affects power control by the trainer device - maybe it’s already working fine or needs a little improvement.
Good to hear it’s working better. You also might enjoy trying slope mode for short intervals but 15s I like ERG. Smoothing is visual only so something strange must have occurred to help resolve your issue. Good news if it stays fixed.
I came to the forum looking for an answer because I have a similar problem.
When I start my session the app won’t change the right power unless I manually decrease the wattage to 90% and change the power back to 100% after few sec when the app is starting to change the wattage.
It’s a small thing but very annoying. Other than this everything works flawlessly.
My trainer is Tacx wheel-on model and I think this has started lately. Any idea why this is happening eg has there been any change in the Power Match or in the other code related to the trainer control?
Sorry to hear. Yes, we recently changed power control to fix a different device. That’s the problem is sadly each device works differently and occassionaly an update to fix one negatively affects another. Surprising as the problem we fixed for one device is the problem you now have. Let me see if my developer can review or see any reason why this might happen. I will respond soon.
Hi Alex. Isn’t that the same issue as described here: Intermittent target change problems using ERG - #16 by inuitive
Yes, didn’t you have this problem as well? We recently fixed it but I forgot to ask you if it fixed it for you. I am starting to have a new theory of what it is. We tell the trainer to go into ERG mode and immediately set the power. Maybe after setting the mode we need to wait to send the power change.
Yes I still have this problem. The new version didn’t fix it.
All workouts starting with a ramp are fine. If they don’t start with a ramp I have to press + or - to make ERG kick in and the same after 1 minute or so, when it looses ERG. But then it’s fine for the rest of the workout.
I have gotten so used to always pressing + at the beginning, that I don’t think about this issue most of the time 
Oh, ok, we will keep working on this.
