Oh yes I forgot about that. Breakaway was going for mainstream also and that guy that started it, Jordan, used to work at Strava. I am sure they plan to come out with main stream coaching long term. I have never heard of anyone using breakaway.
I had an idea to combine the game changing HR+ function with this workout structure.
Using this, there is no need to worry about reacting to reaching the 83% HR cap in the protocol: Trainer Day takes care of that.
Just keep pedalling and the power will change as necessary to respect the HR cap.
In this workout, each of the 20 minute intervals starts with 1 minute in ERG mode at the protocolās 85% FTP. Then HR+ takes over for 19 minutes.
Currently I have set the HR to 146 (81% of my HR max). I think that will give enough room to respect the 83% cap. If that doesnāt match your HR zones, edit the workout to set that HR+ target to whatever you need / want. In the workout editor, the numbers in yellow are the ones to change

Here is a link to the workout. If you try it, please consider commenting about it here.
ETA: based on feedback (next post down) from @Alex I added target power to the HR+ controlled sections of the 20 minute intervals.
I love these creative ideas. I wish we had more bandwidth to improve the shareability of HR+ workouts % of threshold or hrmax⦠Some how to me the zero watt hr+ sections look strange but in reality at least it clearly highlights its not power based. A few problems occur when you donāt have a target power, if you wanted to make a quick power based adjustment to fix an hr problem you cant (click erg press up/down does not work), and second is you cant mouse over to see what the target is on the website.
Itās interesting you happen to be right on this edge of 85/83 it seems. From my perspective for most just having an 83% cap gives 95-99% of the benefit. So like you, I think your current plan is ideal. Get your power up instantly and then sustain by HR, itās a great idea.
I think this is a clever use of the HR+ feature.
I was curious to see the response time and I remembered another forum user @Gbonhommd posted a similar concept workout 1-2 weeks ago: [SOLVED] - HR Targets not working after erg segments in custom workouts - #48 by Alex
I grabbed a screen shot of his data and added a few lines.
The response time is pretty good in my opinion. Power response will be down to each individual user.
Dave
It depends how big the gap between current HR and target HR is.
Here is a zoom in on the first 90 seconds or so of my HR+ workout today. Target is 128 bpm and the starting point is 80 bpm
The idea of using an ERG section before switching over to HR+ is to put HR pretty close to the target when the switch over happens.
In the 3x20 workout above, the ERG section should deliver a more ferocious jump in power than just engaging HR+ would cause.
I havenāt tried the workout myself yet, so I donāt know for sure. Even if it isnāt quite right in its current form, I expect it can be polished up a bit if need be.
Your thinking should work exactly as you expect, unless your HR is noticeably below the 83% when you get to the end of erg, then it will keep raising the power to get you there. You could do 85% longer until hr 82% or so if your current erg is too short.
Here is a chart showing my HR response to the start of an 85% FTP interval earlier this week.
Appreciating that other people will respond differently, I donāt think many will be far off the target level after 1 minute.
But it is easy enough to fine tune the workout, if that is what it needs.
Really cool to see more people experimenting with this. Iāve been using a similar ERG ā HR+ structure for a few months now, mostly to keep my tempo days from drifting into threshold territory when my recovery isnāt exactly legendary these days
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Iāve been building my workouts around Matt Fitzgeraldās zones, matching %FTP and HR targets:
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Z1 ā 55% FTP / 105 bpm
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Z2 ā 70% FTP / 125 bpm
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Z3 Tempo ā 85% FTP / 135 bpm*
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Z4 Threshold ā 100% FTP / 145 bpm
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Z5 ā 115% FTP / 155 bpm
So far Iāve mostly applied this structure to my tempo sessions, since HR drift can sneak up on me if I donāt keep it in check. A minute of ERG gets me in the right spot, then HR+ keeps things honest without turning Z3 into an unplanned Z4 sufferfest.
If anyoneās curious, these are the workouts Iāve created so far:
Next step for me is adapting the same ERG ā HR+ idea to threshold workouts, which should help stay consistent while rebuilding fitness.
Love seeing different takes on the concept. HR+ is becoming one of the most useful tools for steady-state work. ![]()
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I was going to ask since I pretty much exclusively use Linux at home and only have a dual boot laptop in those rare cases when I need MSFT to do something I just canāt figure out on Linux.
I figured there are not a lot of users to justify creating a TD app for Linux. Just going to refurb an old laptop and connect to the trainer through a web browser, my old eyes just canāt use the phone app anymore. ![]()
Ah, I just realized I can not run a workout directly through the web browser. Is that a feature you might be willing to add? Or the Linux app? Currently I send the workouts from TD to the Wahoo head unit, but Iām not entirely sure the HR+ feature truly works that way.
The other thing Iāve tried is to open the TD app, have the head unit up but in passive mode (controlled by another app), but this doesnāt seem to work very effectively either. I must be doing something wrong.
Iād really like to get this nailed down as I love the HR+ feature and the hack you guys came up with for ERG mode for the first minute.
You can watch on web browser but you still need phone for control. We would like to do desktop based but still need to be bigger.
I am in love with the idea of linux and I have 4 linux devices in the house but we are still deep in the apple world. Even for this project need apple for xcode. I recently converted an old intel mac mini to linux and have one old linux laptop with omarchy on it⦠but I cant seem to use it other than when my kids steal my computers. Linux for servers or terminal stuff is heaven.
Laptop is nice if you have touchscreen. Else it is not really user friendly.
I do mirror my Android phone screen on a touchscreen laptop. And that is like a huge phone
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Only downside is that I have to connect phone to laptop with USB cable. At least for the solutions I was able to find.
Scrcpy runs on Windows, but you should be able to find something for Linux too.
I tried the ERG/ HR+ hybrid 3x20 for the first time today. I plan to do it tomorrow too.
Here is how it looked in intervals. If you spot anything in the screenshot that you want to mention, please do.
In comparison to the standard ERG version of this workout that I completed a couple of times last week:
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As you can see from the chart, I seemed to find the start of the first interval harder in HR+ mode. HR went high and stayed high for longer than I expected. That interval ended up being below the 85% FTP target (at 82%). I think it took me abut half of the first interval to become accustomed to the work in HR+ mode, which is definitely different to flat power. I am interested to see how the start of the first interval looks next time.
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I spent more time at higher HR than when power was flat. I think this is because of the near continuous power changes associated with HR+ mode. Those little spikes upwards do seem to add more fatigue (for me). They do make the workout feel more like a real ride outdoors, which (in my book) is good.
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There is a quite noticeable increase in power from interval 1 to interval 2 and then to interval 3. I am not surprised by this (there was a comparable drop in HR across the intervals at fixed power last week), but I am (pleasantly) surprised that interval 3 was so far above the nominal 85% associated with the workout. In these training zones, I would rather have the opportunity to do more power at a target HR, than to do a target power at a lower HR.
So, is it better to do these workouts in ERG mode, with an 85% FTP target and an 83% HR cap, or predominantly in HR+ mode respecting the HR cap and allowing the power to do as it will?
Right now I think it is the latter, HR+ for the win. As long as the HR cap is fully respected (which means setting the target lower than the cap). It eliminates the need to modify FTP and it delivers a workout that is more realistic to the riding I will do outside.
That looks really good. Did you use the first minute of each tempo segment in FTP mode (to prep the heart rate to be where it should) or it is all in HR+ mode?
The first minute of each of the tempo segments is ERG mode. I copied that idea from the workouts you posted previously!
I think it does get the HR up a bit more quickly than HR+ mode would.
Full details of the workout are here.
I was wondering about the little spike in power at the beginning of each tempo segment. Otherwise it really looks amazing, without any power drift. Looks like you are in very good shape!
That chart is power / hr. So rather than a spike in power, it is the time it takes for HR to catch up to the step up in power



